Politics Thread

Z1107

New member
Since we occasionally delve into this in the post whore thread, I'll create a thread for it specifically. Since some people do not understand what a mature debate is follow the rules precisely or you will be banned by our mods since this is a delicate issue. Remember a debate is nothing more than a mature argument using FACTUAL evidence to validate your point.
Rules:
1. NO name calling
2. Everyone is stubborn about their beliefs, if you find yourself engaging someone who cannot empathize with your opinion, ignore them. If it becomes a problem turn it over to a mod.
3. Opposite of above, when engaging someone try to empathize with their position and opinion to understand how they came to their conclusion, you don't have to agree but try to understand.
4. Bashing the military will not be tolerated on any level.
5. If you do not have a basic understanding of the constitution, or the structure of our government you need not post.
6. Learn from each other, as we all live in different corners of the country an different walks of life some people have an inside perspective on a subject you may not.
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
This goes against forum rule number 10 but I will allow it this time on a trial basis. The moment it gets out of hand it will be shut down. I understand that people would like to discuss politics and some subjects, in their own rights, are political in nature... Let's keep it here in this thread.
 

Vermont

New member
Since we occasionally delve into this in the post whore thread, I'll create a thread for it specifically. Since some people do not understand what a mature debate is follow the rules precisely or you will be banned by our mods since this is a delicate issue. Remember a debate is nothing more than a mature argument using FACTUAL evidence to validate your point.

Great Idea I will help you out here just so we can make sure and keep it nice and somewhat civil...

4. Bashing the military will not be tolerated on any level.

Please? Just a little bit won't hurt.... :tard:
 

Z1107

New member
This goes against forum rule number 10 but I will allow it this time on a trial basis. The moment it gets out of hand it will be shut down. I understand that people would like to discuss politics and some subjects, in their own rights, are political in nature... Let's keep it here in this thread.

The main problem with this topic that is an issue on other forums is lack of or biased oversight by moderators. I believe the environment we have created here can contain and foster productive dialogue between members without members getting hurt buttholes.
 

Z1107

New member
What should be our first topic? How about, since a large proportion of our members are military, what is your opinion of how we should respond to the Iranians closing the strait of Hormuz to the US Navy?
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
I'm looking at a geographical map of the area and it looks like it is in Iranian territory. If that is the case then I feel they have every right to ask us to respect their boundaries and stay the fuck out. But if they are expecting us to stay out of the entire water way between Iran and the UAE then I say they can go scratch.
 

Z1107

New member
It's split half and half, but dont hold me to this next statement I'll have to do some research but I believe that deep water channels that support shipping are considered international waters for shipping and maritime purposes. Plus Iran is like china and claims their maritime boundaries further than international law allows.
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
Yeah that's what it looks like to me. I don't think they have a leg to stand on IMO.
 

Vermont

New member
I'm looking at a geographical map of the area and it looks like it is in Iranian territory. If that is the case then I feel they have every right to ask us to respect their boundaries and stay the fuck out. But if they are expecting us to stay out of the entire water way between Iran and the UAE then I say they can go scratch.

The sea lanes that Iran is threatening to close are actually part of the sovereign nation of Oman's waters. Many western foreign affair think tanks suspect that the main reason behind this show of force around the area is due mainly to their up coming activation of their nuclear reactor. Which makes sense as the Iranian government is trying to show the west that if NATO/Israel tries to take any military action against them over the power plant, then they will make use pay dearly in lost oil revenue and lost oil trade. All they need to do is mine the straights and we will be looking at a very nasty oil crisis for the west and particularly america.

The Iranian Revolutionary Guard has recently tested a mid range ballistic missile that is capable of hitting U.S. bases in the region and potentially strike Israel as well. Also with the recent close ties too China that Iran has fostered it might be worth while to note the Chinese anti-ship guided missile that they have recently developed and tested. Whether or not they would sell them to Iran is still up in the air as far as I have heard.

What can be assured is that this type of posturing that Iran is undertaking has made the Israelis very nervous. This not something any sane person would do lightly as the Israelis have been known to act very rashly when they feel threatened. Such as when the IDF bombed A suspected nuclear reactor out side of Baghdad back in 1981. I would not put it past them to under take similar action, and with out warning us of their intentions either. With the current security situation in Iraq, which I would be willing to bet Iran is behind, Israel would have no problem moving aircraft through their air space undetected.

Any action that the U.S. takes at this point needs to take these things into consideration. As one mistake could very easily lead to another conflict in the middle east and another economic crisis here in America; and with election time right around the corner the president has no desire to mire us into another drawn out middle eastern war.
 

IGOTASTi

System Operator
Staff member
Holy you are in charge of this thread pal. :)
 

Z1107

New member
My biggest grief is Iran is stating they will use force to stop our carriers. I don't think Obama has the balls to stand up to them.
 

Vermont

New member
I put that rule there for a reason... But since JJ and Holy gave their blessings I'm adding the following rule to this thread.

-No moderators or admins can participate in this thread other than to moderate.

Suck it. :tard:

Penis wrinkle... :(
 

Vermont

New member
I put that rule there for a reason... But since JJ and Holy gave their blessings I'm adding the following rule to this thread.

-No moderators or admins can participate in this thread other than to moderate.

Suck it. :tard:

"cough" Fuji "cough" hmmmmm.....

-This is why we really need to work on building up other things than conventional forces. Less force on force BS, more giant lasers on satellites.

Interesting idea, have you ever heard of gravity propelled mass drivers? In essence it is a satellite that sits over gyro-synchronous orbit around the target location. This satellite then releases a very large tungsten and steel spike sheathed in heat shielding with a small positioning rocket motor and guidance system at the back. This then hits the target location with (depending on mass of the object used) more force than a nuclear explosion, think asteroid impact. This system allows for a "conventional" weapon to be used on large scale, as there is no fall out and with the proper material used in the ammunition's construction it would have the capability to eradicate whole mountains. Back in 2004 there was an article about this in both popular science and popular mechanics. Where they were talking about the research that the Air Force (in conjunction with NASA) had all ready put into the idea. Then the whole thing just kinda dropped out of public thought and view. I would be willing to bet my left testie that we have a system like what I am describing up in orbit right now. After all we do have whole units dedicated to space operations (A.K.A. Army Space Command, and yes that is a real unit, trust me I had to act as a range NCO for a bunch of them back in Colorado once).
 

Z1107

New member
Fuji I chose this topic as our first to have something everyone would probably agree on to give some common ground between everyone before diving into domestic policy.
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
Holy you are in charge of this thread pal. :)

Not sure I wanna be :shock: ima scured

I put that rule there for a reason... But since JJ and Holy gave their blessings I'm adding the following rule to this thread.

-No moderators or admins can participate in this thread other than to moderate.

Suck it. :tard:

I'm way out gunned anyway
 

IGOTASTi

System Operator
Staff member
If it gets out of hand one time I want it shut down. We are no drama here!
 

Z1107

New member
Mark this one is for you. What attracts you to Ron Paul so much. I'm a libertarian and love his domestic policy but his isolationist foreign policy is reminiscent of the America first party preWWII. He'd rather stick his head in the sand than accept that there are countries out to bring us down.
 

Vermont

New member
I would not concider my self a libratarian at all but I do tend to lean in that direction. I do like alot of Ron Paul's domestic plans. I do like is foreign policy in some respects. Pulling our troops out of all the counties we current station troops in would be a very good move economicly as were currently have troops based in 62the other counties. The main issue is that it costs alot money to upkeep a force like that. America currently spends more money on defense spending than china, Russia, and the other members of NATO, combined. I think one of the most important things we could do to fix out budget would be to cut military spending. I am not talking about pay or equipment, but stupid ass R&D programs that yield nothing. Like the land warrior program. Also we should not be contracting out as much stuff as we do in military. What we need to do is stream line it.
 
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