Tuning Headache

Bzktmoto

New member
Hey guys, heres my problem and I am not sure what to do. I installed a EWG, APS inlet, TGV deletes and a grimmspeed ebcs. Once I finished i did some logging for Clark Turner and he came back and told me I have an intake leak somewhere because my MAF voltage was 1.3, my idle is around 850-920 rpms, A/F ratio is 11 when my gate opens up and my fuel trims were around 25. So I pressure tested my intake and found a few leaks but when I logged on my own I still have the idleing, MAF voltage and A/F ratio problems.

I am not sure what to do next, when I pressurize my intake system at around 14-15 psi air starts leaking out of the EWG dumptube, but no where else. So I'm thinking I fixed all my vacuum leaks but whats up with the EWG, anyone know if this is normal? I am really frustrated and all I want do is get my car back to running without any problems. Thanks in advance.

- Adam
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
As for the waste gate it is on the exhaust side so if you pressurize the intake system it should have no effect on the EWG, It sounds to me like pressure from the intake is leaking past the diaphragm of the EWG into the exhaust side but I'm no expert when it comes to EWG's. I would pressure test the Vac/Press line leading to the waste gate itself to rule out a leak in the diaphragm.

As for the log can you post one so we can have a look? I would not be so concerned with MAF voltage. 1.30 sounds about right to me for an idle. I would however be concerned about the AFR and both fuel trims. If you could make a log with the condition you are seeing that would help allot.

If you have a leak after the MAF sensor but before the turbo it will show in your logs with exaggerated high fuel trims and lean AFR's. If your leak is after the turbo you will see the same condition when at idle but go rich under boost.

George

Hey guys, heres my problem and I am not sure what to do. I installed a EWG, APS inlet, TGV deletes and a grimmspeed ebcs. Once I finished i did some logging for Clark Turner and he came back and told me I have an intake leak somewhere because my MAF voltage was 1.3, my idle is around 850-920 rpms, A/F ratio is 11 when my gate opens up and my fuel trims were around 25. So I pressure tested my intake and found a few leaks but when I logged on my own I still have the idleing, MAF voltage and A/F ratio problems.

I am not sure what to do next, when I pressurize my intake system at around 14-15 psi air starts leaking out of the EWG dumptube, but no where else. So I'm thinking I fixed all my vacuum leaks but whats up with the EWG, anyone know if this is normal? I am really frustrated and all I want do is get my car back to running without any problems. Thanks in advance.

- Adam
 
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HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
Just FYI, Thread moved to Tuning. I thought this was better suited :grin:
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
I'm happy to help!

The idle log doesn't look all that horrible. Is this after you sealed everything up?

The other log suggests something but I'm not quite sure what though. If you look at the data toward the end you will see that short trims are taking away just about as much fuel as is long term is adding so they almost cancel each other out. The thing that concerns me about this one is that throughout that same range of data the AFR is reporting lean. Either there is still a leak somewhere that is eluding you or the MAF scaling is just that bad. It is possible that the MAF sensor itself is dirty as is often the case.

Do this...

- Go pick yourself up some MAF sensor cleaner or electrical contact cleaner and clean the MAF.
- when you have done that please reset the ECU to remove any learned data and take it out and log again. (wait about 5 minutes before you log after a reset)

Is this a pro tune or an OTS map from Cobb?

George
 

Bzktmoto

New member
This is an E-tune from Clark Turner. I will try cleaning the MAF and do an ECU reset and hopefully that helps. I think I'm also going to try to elminate air going to my AOS. I'm pretty sure there is a small leak still coming from one of the hose connections, so If I eliminate air going to it maybe it will uncover a different leak that I don't know about. The only other thing that is bothering me is how my EWG was letting air go out of it before. It doesn't do it now since I clamped the hoses leading to it, but could it be a bad diaphram that is causing all my problems?
 

Bzktmoto

New member
I tried it and it didn't seem to do anything, I did find that my MAF o-ring was broken and I found suitable replacement thinking that was the source of all my problems but unfortunately its not. I am still going into 11's on my A/F ratio as soon as the EWG opens and my idle still seems high.
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
It is highly possible.

This is an E-tune from Clark Turner. I will try cleaning the MAF and do an ECU reset and hopefully that helps. I think I'm also going to try to elminate air going to my AOS. I'm pretty sure there is a small leak still coming from one of the hose connections, so If I eliminate air going to it maybe it will uncover a different leak that I don't know about. The only other thing that is bothering me is how my EWG was letting air go out of it before. It doesn't do it now since I clamped the hoses leading to it, but could it be a bad diaphram that is causing all my problems?
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
I tried it and it didn't seem to do anything, I did find that my MAF o-ring was broken and I found suitable replacement thinking that was the source of all my problems but unfortunately its not. I am still going into 11's on my A/F ratio as soon as the EWG opens and my idle still seems high.

This still sounds like a boost leak to me. It could be the EWG leaking into the exhaust as you mentioned previously. Maybe try spraying starter fluid around in certian spots and listen for changes in rpm.

The idle is generally a function of the tune. Even with a leak the ECU is going to adjust it to what it wants unless there is a leak after the throttle body like in the intake manifold gaskets or the TGV gaskets. Perhaps Clark Tuning made it high to compensate for larger injectors. What size injectors do you have?

Also I note in your previous log that it goes to 11:1 but if you look at the rpm and load that it occurs, it is not unreasonable to see this. The thing is we don't know how much past 11:1 it is actually going with out the benefit of a wide band. It is likely much richer than that. The funny thing about that log is I never really see the Throttle Position to actually go to 99%.

Did you actually go WOT or just open it enough to get the EWG to open?

George
 

Bzktmoto

New member
I just have my stock injectors still, and my throttle position was my doing. I was running out of room so I couldnt completely go 100%. I think I am going to get a wideband AFR so I can be absolutly sure what my AFR's are. I also sent my recent logs to him, so hopefully I should get an answer this week.
 
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HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
Okay good. Yeah like I said 11:1 doesn't seem at all unreasonable at that load and rpm but I really cant be certain unless I can see the fuel targets as well.

Wide bands are your friend.:thumbsup:
 

Bluedemon_II

New member
Op, you said that your going to get a wideband? So it means that you are referencing the A/F to the stock front sensor?

11.1 isn't bad, I about that on my conservative meth tune. On the aggressive one I run about 11.8.

As far as the air coming out of the exhaust, this is normal as the engine doesn't have an hermetic seal and air will scape threw various places. Mine does the same thing and I don't have a leak.
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
Op, you said that your going to get a wideband? So it means that you are referencing the A/F to the stock front sensor?

11.1 isn't bad, I about that on my conservative meth tune. On the aggressive one I run about 11.8.

As far as the air coming out of the exhaust, this is normal as the engine doesn't have an hermetic seal and air will scape threw various places. Mine does the same thing and I don't have a leak.

I would tend to agree. When you pressurize the plenum you assume the throttle plate is closed and the valves are shut. This isn't always the case. Plus when you pressurize it to EWG pressure you will hear this out your dump tube as suggested. Good call, Makes sense.
 

Bzktmoto

New member
Thanks guys that definatly makes sense, I 've beein trying to think through this as well but its tough with everything going on. I sent logs to my tuner and he still says there is a leak and now I am overboosting in addition to the high idle. I am very frustrated at this point because I feel like my tuner should be working with me as you guys are and am not receiving any such treatment. My next step I think is to totally isolate the intake tract. I am going to clamp off vacuum hoses to the EWG, and my AOS in the hopes that something shows up. Holycrapitsfast, since we know air is going to leak out regardless because its not a fully sealed system because of the orientation of the intake valves, if I don't hear any leaks is it safe to say I have gotten them all even though the pressure on the gauge is falling?
 

HolyCrapItsFast

Drinks beer!
I really don't want to say it is safe to assume that. I have been known to be wrong.

Do this as it has work beautifully for me in the past...

Burn a cigar and fill the plenum with smoke. When you are satisfied there is enough smoke in there (maybe pull a hose at the farthest end of the manifold to allow the smoke to propagate through the system, then reinstall the hose), then seal it up and pressurize it. Look for smoke leaking out of places. No smoke = no leak, smoke = leaks.
 

IGOTASTi

System Operator
Staff member
You need to call me and set a appoint up at our garage! We can fix anything!
 

IGOTASTi

System Operator
Staff member
Let me check the shops scheduled! We our busy busy busy!
 

Bzktmoto

New member
Well guys I tried using smoke and it didn't really work as I would of hoped. I pressurized it and didn't hear any areas leaking. I took new logs and sent them to Clark so hopefully he has something positive tomorrow to tell me but if not, Im running out of options. I don't like driving my car around like this for much longer so I think Im going to take a trip up to Innovative Tuning and have them do the diagonstic work and then tune it.
 
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